A couple of questions...

I've noticed when playing and looking through the KS Scenarios that scripting isn't much of a thing and there's one objective at most - at least in the scenarios I've looked at so far. I'm wanting to remove most of the objectives and scripting from the Quatre Bras scenario aside from the reinforcement schedule and rely on the KS AI to "do its job".

My first question is how does the AI handle Major and Minor objectives? There was a throw-away comment somewhere (maybe in the SDK manual) stating that the only difference between Major and Minor was how the AI handled them. I'm thinking - two Major and maybe one Minor at most.

My second question relates to divisional structure - the OOB in Quatre Bras for the French and Allied forces has cavalry-only divisions. How does the KS AI handle such forces? The KS scenarios I've looked at so far seem to always have inf/cav/art as a mixture in a division.  I'm thinking of reworking the OOB to divide the cavalry regiments among the other divisions including Kellerman's once it arrives (and removing the Guard Light Cavalry entirely).

My third question relates to "who am I". In Quatre Bras, I am Marshal Ney and I think because of this I am unlikely to ever receive any subordinate reports as I suspect they are going/would go to Reille. Is that the case? Should I be changing the scenario.ini file to play as Reille? How does that sort of thing affect the AI side? Should I merge everything into one Corps?

My fourth question relates to adding locations to a map to help giving orders by courier. Can I just add them to the map.csv file?

My first question is how does the AI handle Major and Minor objectives? There was a throw-away comment somewhere (maybe in the SDK manual) stating that the only difference between Major and Minor was how the AI handled them. I'm thinking - two Major and maybe one Minor at most.

I don't know how the AI handles a minor objective. If there are several major objectives, the AI will randomly pick one and concentrate on it. I have seen instances of it trying to occupy two, but that is very rare.

My second question relates to divisional structure - the OOB in Quatre Bras for the French and Allied forces has cavalry-only divisions. How does the KS AI handle such forces? The KS scenarios I've looked at so far seem to always have inf/cav/art as a mixture in a division. I'm thinking of reworking the OOB to divide the cavalry regiments among the other divisions including Kellerman's once it arrives (and removing the Guard Light Cavalry entirely).

The KS group almost always play at the division level. Cavalry can be a very dominating force. If there is an enemy cavalry force on the field along with infantry and artillery and the player is without his own cavalry, then it will be a very long day for him. A cavalry division is fine for a player to command, but he cannot be everywhere on the field at once. It is not unusual for him to receive requests from several fellow players at the same time for cavalry support. Detaching a brigade and sending it to another part of the field is possible, but that brigade is usually not very effective without some human input. The requesting player usually has a very specific task he'd like the cavalry to perform, and of course, he can't control it. As a result, we like to have mixed divisions.

My third question relates to "who am I". In Quatre Bras, I am Marshal Ney and I think because of this I am unlikely to ever receive any subordinate reports as I suspect they are going/would go to Reille. Is that the case? Should I be changing the scenario.ini file to play as Reille? How does that sort of thing affect the AI side? Should I merge everything into one Corps?

In SP, the corps commander will receive all the reports. He will receive scouting reports, the sighting of the enemy by the division commander, the regular updates that the division commander sends which reports the number of enemy faced and his own approximate casualty level. I could change the code in a future update where the human army level player would get these reports.

My fourth question relates to adding locations to a map to help giving orders by courier. Can I just add them to the map.csv file?

Yes.

Many thanks for the info.

I shall keep it to one major objective. I have also amended the force structure slightly to split the initially-deployed cavalry between Foy and Bachelu's divisions but I am keeping Kellerman's cavalry as a separate unit - we'll see how that plays out.

I was looking through the Scenario Generator manual and came across these two paragraphs:

In general, it is best to limit the AI to one corps. The army commander is for all practical purposes, brain dead. Usually,
only one corps will be active in some fashion with any others just staying in their original locations for the duration of
the battle. If you wish the AI to command an especially large force, simply give his corps the extra divisions needed. The
player side can, of course be composed of more than one corps, provided there is a human to give them their marching
orders.

Be wary of creating cavalry divisions for SP or co-op MP games. The AI treats them as any other division. It will not hold
them back until later in the battle as a human would. This results in the cavalry often being wasted. Additionally,
consolidating the cavalry on the human side gives the player(s) an enormous advantage over the AI. For these types of
games, it is better to create mixed divisions of infantry, cavalry and artillery. This may not be historically accurate, but it
will result in a more challenging battle.

On the basis of this, I will revist the Allied (AI) side for Quatre Bras.

All of that is true, but it assumes there is no scripting in the scenario.  Since the AI is scripted, you can easily have multiple corps and AI controlled cavalry divisions.  If you wait till late in the scenario to release the player, controlled, Kellerman cavalry division, it might not have an overwhelming impact.  Or you could release it in bits and pieces as if it is arriving on the field piecemeal and being fed into the battle.

Hi,

I'm posting these questions here since they cover different aspect of the game. Most of them are about small bugs and the gameplay that I managed to go around, but that could be quite annoying sometimes:

1. Multiple clicks to get reaction
Often when I play, I need to click 5 times on the cavarly scout button in order that 50 men detach from the regiment and go scouting. Why one click is not enough ? It seems that the AI is not responding every time I click even if I can see a courrier sent to my subordinate.

2. Commander movements are not smooth
Why is there a bug when moving my Commander in Chief in HITS mode ? The right click to sent him to a chosen place doesn't work smoothly. I often need to click several time at different places until the arrow appears on the floor and my guy starts moving

3. Command map order
When using the map command and HITS mode to move my Commander in Chief. It happens frequently that this order is interpreted as the new target position for his subordinates. Why is that?

4. Artillery command
Why the different options of target selection for artillery never work ? I tried with TC and not TC and seems to be the same

5. Deployment orientation with map
Do you know a technique to settle the division orientation when using map command ? Sometimes, according to the initial division orientation, it will deploy on line with a totally unappropriate direction. It seems that the option "orient our units to that direction" in the courrier menu only allows regiment to rotate on the selected direction and not the whole division.

6. Courrier order never cancelled
When I use the courrier menu to order a division to go on the right flank of another division, it seems to be attached to it the whole game ! It could be an advantage to some extent, but if I want to order that first division to go elsewhere, it seems to obey at first, but the AI finally re adapt the target to follow the very first order "go on right flank of...". At the end, this first division will just follow the second division movement, which is a problem. How can I definitely cancel the "go on right flank" order... ?

7. Road movement bug
When I want to move quickly on road. I don't manage to impose regiment to walk in column. They usually use roads by marching in line. I usually need to click 10 times on column button to finally force them. But in HITS mode I'm never sure that they adopted this basic formation to go quicker. Is there something that I forget on command buttons ?

8. Tactics on defensive formation
More tactical question. Do you have advices to attack a solid defensive line of one or two division with artillery well deployed in front of infantry ? Any frontal attack is just a slaughter except if I put my own cannons in front of them.

Doing my best, I'm sure someone with more experience than I will come along sooner or later as well.

1.) It takes some time for the battalion to organize the scouting party after they receive the order to do so. Maybe 5-10 seconds.  If you click the button once, wait for the courier to get to them, and wait a bit, they should form a scouting party.  Only once have I ever noticed that the battalion doesn't form a scouting party after ordering them to(and I only noticed it in a recording XD).  Maybe you're just not waiting long enough?  Could be bugged as you report as well though in which case I can't offer any help.  

2.) This could be a few reasons, but my guess is it's to do with the flag.  The flags in this game have a hit box.  You cannot give a move order through your own flag that floats above your head.  Some armies have large flags, and the ones with a pole (Russian I think?) have an issue where the hitbox for the flag is a big rectangle that includes a bunch of transparent space next to the pole.  I'm thinking you might be inadvertently trying to move but end up clicking on your commander's flag's hitbox.  If this is the case the work around is to try adjusting your camera so that where you want to move to isn't blocked by the flag.  This might mean moving it down lower to the ground, or perhaps forward to get in front of the flag, or to the sides.  Just try moving the camera around.  You kind of get a feel for it after a while and stop noticing.  If this isn't the case then I hope someone else can help.

3.) As far as I know, when you have yourself selected as division commander to click on the command map will give your entire division the order to move there.  This is handy at the start of games when you want to move out without having to give a bunch of individual brigade orders.  It does mean however that if you want to move only yourself as the commander you must click on the actual ground, rather than use the command map.

4.) Having only really ever used the Target Inf, Target Cav, and Target Arty buttons, I can't say I've ever seen them not work.  I haven't tried telling them to fire at a specific unit yet, but if I ask them to shoot at cav or arty or infantry they do change targets for me.  Reasons you might see them not switch include: it takes a bit of time for them to switch (round about one full volley of time), they might not be able to see any of the target you asked them to shoot at, and they do switch back to what ever they deem is the best target after a little bit or if they don't have sight of the target you asked anymore.

5.) I think you can give a brigade (or division) a specific command complete with facing via the messages though I have never done so, so I couldn't tell you how  Using the command map will just have the unit facing whatever direction it was traveling in I think.  So if you told them to move north from their current position they will face north.  I tend to use the command map orders only for maneuvers that I know are safe, or for getting on the road at the start of a battle.  Once I make contact and the enemy is in sight I switch to commanding via the normal way rather than the map.  Also I'll sometimes use it for a reserve brigade to move them around in a safe area just because it's easier.  But yes, as far as I know, the facing can't be given if using the command map.

6.) Sadly I'm not sure I can help that much on this one.  I don't use the message system to order my things around, mostly because I don't know how.  

7.) This one's always a conundrum.  I think if you give a move order on the command map that is over 1 mile they will automatically use march column and roads.  If it's under that distance they will not.  That might be slightly incorrect in some ways.  The recommended pattern for orders (command map or not) is to click a destination, click a formation, click use roads (if desired).  So if you were at the start of a battle and wanted to use a road to somewhere you would select whatever force you want to move (if playing a division have yourself selected to move the whole division) then click the blue 'march column button' under the 'Move' tab and then click the 'use roads' button.  If you want to adjust your order after that just repeat the process.  Any move order will by default use the existing formation and will not use roads(with potential exception to the instance I spoke of where by you're moving more than 1 mile with command map (but maybe I'm wrong so even so maybe ignore this exception )).  That said, sometimes, not often but still sometimes, I'll tell a brigade to go somewhere, in march column, using roads and one of the battalions just won't go into march column.  I don't know what the deal is, I just assume it's the battalion commander being inept, drunk, or otherwise incapable of forming march column.  But that happens rarely enough that it's not usually a problem.

8.) A full frontal attack on artillery in a good position with infantry and cavalry defending it is ill advised and is a tactic that is only acceptable in desperate times, or you have another player under your command and you want to hilariously order the death of his brigade. Any given tactical situation is going to be different and in my opinion that largely comes down to the terrain.  That of course means most of the time your answer to removing an enemy from a superior position is going to be using the terrain to your advantage.  Hollows, ridges, and other undulations of the ground might make good cover for moving your forces around without being over exposed to the enemy artillery.  Likewise heavy forests provide very good cover from artillery provided the unit fits inside of them, so if you see enemy guns near a wood you can probably get your men close without taking too many casualties.  Of course it's hard to fight in thick woods just due to lack of visibility so that can be a double edged sword.  As you pointed out yourself, another good tactic is just having a good old fashioned artillery duel.  If you can keep your men protected from their guns and cause damage to the enemy with your guns I always consider that just pure winning.  Of course that strategy requires you to have the time for a drawn out artillery duel, and it requires the ground be good enough that your guns can rival theirs.  Sometimes you have no options, no time, no position, and you simply MUST assault in front of guns.  In that case attacking on a wide front, using all the tricks I listed that you can, with the strongest attack being made where the ground is best is your best bet.  Hopefully you have some friendly nearby support that you can ask to flank the enemy while you fix them, otherwise it's going to be a lot of bloodshed for minimal gain.  One further trick for the desperate frontal assault would be to try to get your opponent to commit his reserves and then hit him where he's weakest.


I hope that helped!  I can't help but pimp out my humble, amateurish stream a little bit so feel free to ignore the rest of this if you have no interest. https://mixer.com/DumpTruckGames I stream SOW on the days this group plays together (Tues, Fri, Sun @ 3PM EST (usually it's 2PM but we've been doing 3PM recently for day light savings time shenanigans or something).  They're obviously quite long, and might not be the pinnacle of entertainment, but I'd like to think that my tactical brilliance shows through at least sometimes.  And if you happened to be in the chat asking questions I would be more than happy to answer them.  Here's a link to the past streams that it saves for 2 weeks since they air.  https://mixer.com/dashboard/channel/vods  The one from March 17 is quite good if I do say so myself.  The first 2 hours or so is the conclusion of an earlier game, but the second game we play on that day where we are French is a pretty good one.  It was good fun trying to survive the full on attack without cavalry support.

I'm a bit pushed for time but regarding No 5.....

I've just started using only the courier system and only using divisional and brigade commands.

I do the following:

1. Stance
2. Move to a position on the map (more on that later)
3. Face in a direction
4. Adopt formation.

The last one is the key - even if they're already in the formation you're ordering.

(same with the command map otherwise the only thing you're doing I think is orienting the commander in that direction)

The two responses above should answer most of your questions. Here are answers to 3 others.

Why the different options of target selection for artillery never work ? I tried with TC and not TC and seems to be the same

I assume you mean selecting a specific unit to fire at. This command does not work at the battery cmdr. level. You have to select an individual gun and give it a target.

At the end, this first division will just follow the second division movement, which is a problem. How can I definitely cancel the "go on right flank" order... ?

Give the supporting division a command to go to a specific location, (in this case the location it is at), and then give it a formation command. Once this is done, you should be able to move the 2nd division without the 1st following in support.

When I want to move quickly on road. I don't manage to impose regiment to walk in column. They usually use roads by marching in line.

Be sure to use the formation buttons on the Move tab and not the Combat tab. Also, the units will always go into their fighting formation when they see the enemy and are getting close to them.

Hi, thanks for all the answers above

Additionnal questions concerns Skirmish. I'm a bit lost with it, since the changes of version 132 and the different OOB (skirmish vs classic). Actually, how do you suggest to operate with the toolbar in the following situations ?


1. I dont interract at brigade level, just let the AI do the thing. How am I sure they will send skirmishers ?

2. I'm a brigade commander, I try to pull back and screen my troops with skirmishers to delay the ennemies ?
3. I'm a brigade commander, I want to attack an artillery position with skirmishers without line troops being destroyed by cannister ?

1. I dont interract at brigade level, just let the AI do the thing. How am I sure they will send skirmishers ?

If the brigade cmdr. is not TC'd then he will deploy skirmishers automatically.

2. I'm a brigade commander, I try to pull back and screen my troops with skirmishers to delay the ennemies ?
3. I'm a brigade commander, I want to attack an artillery position with skirmishers without line troops being destroyed by cannister ?

To send out skirmishers as a brigade cmdr. press the skirmish button on the move or orders tabt of the cmdr. toolbar. You can also use the Send Out Screen button on the orders tab. If you press one of those buttons a 2nd time, the skirmishers will be recalled. New skirmishers from other btns. may be sent out to replace them if they are available. Remember, a btn. has only one skirmish unit.

Thanks, but it seems that neither the screen button nor the skirmish formation button work. Is there condition needed regarding distance, stance ?

Not all units can send skirmishers and some of them can put whole unit in the skirmish order. With detaching skirmishers I'd be patient - similarly like with sending cavalry scouts, wait 10-20 seconds from when courier reached the battalion. As for things not working - if the battalion is not TC-d it may override your order... If you TC battalion and it's still not working maybe enemy is too close? --> Kevin

As Miko said, not all units can send out skirmishers, for example, grenadier units or militia grade units. Skirmishers will automatically be detached if the enemy is within 700yd. The stance of the cmdr. determines the number of skirmish units that can be detached.

I actually just tried but no reaction, TC or not TC, doesn't change a thing, even waiting 10 or 20 seconds.
I checked if my brigade have skirmish batallions and it is the case. The skirmish formation doesn't work, it seems.

When comparing with cavalry indeed, the screen button works as you suggested, but not for infantry
The only way to have something is to click on regiment skirmish formation button. But that doesn't solve everything.

Last thing, I checked the last column in the OOB considered (OOB_SB_KS_NAP_Austria_Summer_1809.csv, it is the Dalesme brigade that I played with on Sunday 12th), and they indeed have two skirmish batallions. Same thing happens in the equivalent Skirmish OOB, no way to manually trigger skirmish at brigade level (neither with screening, nor with formation button).

Might it be because you are testing the skirmish function way back from enemy?
If so, try Single player, Sandbox, Line of Sight setting.
I'll be honest. I havnt got used to the new skirmish function. I have a tendency to TC my inf brigade commanders and forget to un-Tc them when the action starts.
I spent most of the last game without a skirmish screen for my centre brigade whilst Miko shot away at me with his Jagers/L Ing. The Brigades I deployed my left and right I left un-TC'd. They deployed skirmishers, which I only found out once I watched the replay. I think these brigades had old style skirmish, though.

I tried that also Grog, not working . I need to rely on AI for this then.

Two other things where you could have ideas:
- It seems that routed units doesn't count in battle results (I mean out of the map routed units). I did a brigade to brigade line of sight sandbox with 5 vs 5 regiments (4500 vs 4500 men). I routed all ennemies out of the map without loosing any regiments and 1% casualties. But when you check statistics, I only have a "unconclusive fight' with +100 pts, and equivalent casualties on both side (around 250 men). If routed ennemies doesn't really count, it would bias the aftermath, isn't it ?

- What do you think of the general competence/experience vs units experience ? what is the most important ? When  would you more trust the AI ? Except elite units with 80/90/100 pts experience is there a real difference between 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 experience levels ? Same question for commanders (for brigade most, it seems that division commander rarely have less than 6).

Additional question:
It seems that when we play against AI an entire division never retreats before all batallions are defeated in detail, is it the case or just a feeling ? But if I remember well when playing solo it happens that the division commander sometimes orders a full retreat of his troops of casualties are excessive.