Pat&Kevin French-Russian Campaign Update

I don't know if I can make it on Friday...
But I'm such a small piece in this chessboard that feel totally free to go on without me in case.
As I'm not sure anyway, I won't watch replay in the meantime...
But could one of our "puppet masters" please check the relative position and marching direction of that French unit at the moment they triggered the surrender of my Jaeger battalion (with good morale, close friendly support, no casualties)?
I'm almost sure they were giving me their back.
I guess these 2 units involved had almost matching marching directions...
I'd say there must be some sort of trigs numerical oddity in that part of the code.
They basically behaved like the roles were reversed.
I also remember Ehey's cav. regt surrending to a (ok, rather oversized) Austrian counterpart on similar geometrical conditions not a long time ago.
Thanks in advance.

Also, was the visibility really set to 30 yards?
To me it looked set from 0.5 to 5 instead.  
Maybe some wrong scaling caused by the (uncommon) 10 miles map size?

Last but not least, was it just me or the couriers GUI resulted surprisingly laggy to reach and interact with yesterday?
Is that normal for a 10 (or more) players match?

I reviewed the replay.

The visibility was 30 yd. I think the units popping in and out of view is due to the inherent lag in cycling through each unit and determining whether it is visible or not to the enemy. This is done in the game engine. If the game engine cycles through each btn. every 10 sec. as it does when it runs the AI code, then moving troops could easily cover 30 yd. in that period of time. This would give the impression that the enemy popped out of the ground right on top of the moving btn or officer.

Those jagers surrendered after taking 5 casualties. It was probably casualties taken from the French attacking the rear of jagers. This would have caused a panic, forcing a retreat or possible rout. Since the jagers were in the same space as the French btn. they had no path of retreat open to them so they surrendered.

The lag was indeed due to the number of players. When the number reached 8 or more, the game noticeably slows. Throw in a bad internet connection and it gets very laggy.

My Dragoon Regiment will be upset for a restart. Taking our that artillery battery, which suddenly appeared in my ranks, must have been the easiest kill since Dorothy's house landed on top of the Wicked Witch of the East!
I'm going to have to go easy on the Wizard of Oz references, I think

Peskyvich wrote:
Those jagers surrendered after taking 5 casualties. It was probably casualties taken from the French attacking the rear of jagers. This would have caused a panic, forcing a retreat or possible rout. Since the jagers were in the same space as the French btn. they had no path of retreat open to them so they surrendered.

I think they never routed Kevin. They surrender while in fallback/retreat state and with excellent morale.
Please note, this was happening after they got the get away command, while receiving the retreat state updates.
That's a subtle but important difference, because the escape path checks are run only once a get away (or rout) command is issued/processed.
During the retreat updates, they must surrender only if no commander/nearby friendly unit bonuses are set (which should have been the case due to limited visibility distance), and if the enemy unit (distant less than 200yds, morale >= 3, men >= 2, inf/cav, not fallingback or routing) sprites envelope polygon interesects ours, after a dice roll probabilities (I think 15% for my jaegers) are tested against a table based on current xp and morale levels.
That polygon check is rather problematic imho for large formations like oversized austrians or light troops deployed en grande-bande like on Tuesday.
Because also due to different update rates between UpdateMV (where the poly is built by taking the max and min coord of every single unit sprite, this axis aligned stuff not object aligned) and UpdateRetreat, if enemy intent is to move back (not by doing an about face, but a pivot rotation), you're very likely to run those critical checks while they are halfway in such a manouver (apparently quick, but not enough even for a good laggy SOW game   ).
Catching their (potentially wide) formation sprites arranged diagonally and thus getting an inflated axis aligned envelope (possibly outdated too) where in truth sprites are not really intersecting.

Kevin wrote:The lag was indeed due to the number of players. When the number reached 8 or more, the game noticeably slows. Throw in a bad internet connection and it gets very laggy.

I didn't know that showing or interacting with the couriers UI was a lock-stepped command too.
Doesn't make a lot of sense as I'm supposed to execute "local operations" until I send any message, but that could perfectly be a valid reason.
Thanks.

The wheeling would explain some of the odd behavior, (British types, this is the correct spelling), we sometimes see when a unit tries to get away from the enemy.

To build an insanely big collision quad, they probably don't even need to wheel.
Just facing a direction that isn't aligned with the NS or WE axis...
I remember me and Ehey were once dealing with one of those oversized (as usual) Austrian dragoons regiment.
He was charging frontally I think with courassiers and me outflanking almost from the rear (the absurd is the more you take them from the rear, the worse).
I had a small - GetAway fated - regt, I think Dragoni Reali, wearing some rather suspicious red jackets.
Well, they didn't wear regulation uniforms, but certainly they brought a good stock of white flags on the battlefield.

If we could create a scenario that reproduce such a situation (maybe with alpha omega on?), we might try to set all the entries in the probabilities table to 100% and verify this once and for all.

We set a modern day record for crashes today

Unreal

Commanders will get updated info and we will see what is next.

On Sept 1st the French and Russians clashed in the hills and woods around Haschendorf. Two days later the Armies clashed near the sleepy village of Wehlau. And now on 4 Sept we resume operational movement on the 30-mile map.

The Russians had pulled back 4 or 5 miles in the wake of the Haschendorf battle, claiming victory over their hated French foe. Naturally the French likewise claimed victory. Interestingly so did the Norwegians for some random reason.

Anyway on 2 Sept Justin de Tolly made good use of the incessant rain and fog that had moved into the area and readied a counterstroke for the pursuing French, setting up for battle about 5 miles SE of Haschendorf as the weather cleared. But Miko-Napoleon is a wily foe, aggressive yet not prone to over-extending himself.

As a result, both armies slammed into each other during the pre-dawn hours of 3 Sept. Residents of Wehlau, hiding in their cellars with deathgrips on their treasured “Yes I love trees just like Phil” placards, awoke to nearby sounds of sharp musketry and cannon fire

In a bizarre twist, The heavens unexpectedly opened up in the middle of battle. Powder became wet. Visibility dropped. Combat operations ceased as abruptly as they started. Apparently the clearing in the weather at the battle’s outset was short lived. The royal weather forecasters in several European countries were summarily sacked, with a handful being executed. In the distance, Kevin laughed a hearty laugh.

As 3 September now draws to a close, Russians and French are no longer in visual range of each other. The roads are becoming muddy as the rain continues down in torrents.

We are now back to the operational phase. Commanders will soon get their situation updates for the morning of 4 Sept. Will yet another battle be fought on the 10 mile map? Or will the Borodino map come into play? Stay tuned!

"In the distance, Kevin laughed a hearty laugh."

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8c2yni6srxgtuhq/Laughs%20in%20Kevin.jpg

Are we allowed to watch the reply now?

yes

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8c2yni6srxgtuhq/Laughs%20in%20Kevin.jpg

How did you do that? I didn't think my camera was on.

The campaign continues!

Both commanders just now received updates for 1400hrs 4 Sept.

It would appear the next round of fighting will be on the Borodino map, which includes forts, redoubts and fleeing citizens from Wehlau from the 10-mile map. Truth be told, the citizens in this campaign tend to flee in a direction directly opposite of the units Kevin happens to be commanding. Since Kevin rotates positions each tactical scenario, this tends to have an effect not unlike tennis or ping-pong ... back and forth they go.

My presence on the field is feared by all. Or maybe it's because I don't bathe regularly?

Another exciting situation. I am glad the wheels are still turning on this. Sadly I am busy this Friday. Though I will be available Sunday and Tuesday before missing the weekend after that and potentially more. You don't need to wait up for me though if you guys have enough to play without me do feel free. After the next two weeks my busy season will largely be over so I'll be more around soon.

The campaign continues and I am pleased to announce that we have departed the 10-mile map! We will soon transition to a tactical battle in the SW portion of the Borodino map. We have just now begun the process to create a tactical scenario with associated information. The earliest timeframe for this battle will be in the vicinity of 17-21 Sept depending upon player availability

The respective army commanders now have the full set of tactical information: OOBs, division placement and intelligence. Again the Russians and French will clash in the pre-dawn hours. Those of you with Kevin on your team, just be aware that your personal baggage trains are most vulnerable to him in the dark. Keep a close watch.

Action at Doromino!

A pitched battle took place this morning along the woods and ridges southwest of Doromino. French forces emerged out of the woods as the sun rose and a hard fought battle ensued. Reports of significant loss of heavy cavalry on the Russian side. It appears the French took heavy losses in artillery. Commanders will be digesting situation reports and casualty lists.

Stay tuned.

Indeed a very bloody day. Tough choices ahead for the army commanders.

The battle resumes!

A morning slugfest near Doromino will, after a few hours rest and resupply, pick up where it left off.

If all division commanders are present, we could resume the fight as early as Tuesday

A major clash again at Doromino!

After a short respite of almost 8 hours the clash between titans resumed and lasted into early evening. Desperate fighting along the morning’s battle lines lasted about an hour or so, at which points the Russian line gave way. The Russian northern flank collapsed at Doromino and the 6y Korpus fell into headlong retreat through the woods towards Utitza, several miles East. French troops pursued closely.

There are conflicting reports on casualties. Both sides suffered losses at least as bad as the morning fight, but given the way in which the Tsars finest turned tail, the Russians might have come out worse.

As the sun sets and casualty reports arrive at respective headquarters, both commanders will reorganize and contemplate next steps. Stay and fight? Withdrawal?